Letters to the Editor

By: Michiel van der Vlist == MV
To: Michael Grant ....... == MG

Hi Michael,

> Mv> That is not what the Z1 sysops said when they rammed P4
> Mv> through our throat the sheer power of numbers. Now that
> Mv> the balance of numbers is reversed it suddenly ain't a
> Mv> number of sysops game anymore?
>
MG> Using your argument, zone 2 ought to be "ramming" something
MG> down out throats at the moment.

MV> No, I am just saying that you can't have your cake and eat it too. It was Z1 that imposed P4 on Z2 by majority rule. Now that the numbers have turned you can't change the rules if we hold you to something in it that you don't like any more.

MG> If the zone 2 members don't like things too much, why
MG> aren't they very vocal about it?

MV>For one, there is a long history of being shouted down. Now that the numbers have turned and Z1 no longer calls the shots, they are probably not all that interested any more in what goes on in Z1. "Let them make their own mess" is probably the general attitude. My personnel opinion is that they are wrong and that Z1's mess will affect the network as a whole and that is why I am one of the few that bothers to speak up.

MG> If the vast majority of zone 2 members choose to sit on
MG> their hands and do nothing,

MV> What makes you think the Z2 sysops are sitting on their hands and doing nothing?

WB> Good question. The answer that pops into mind immediately is your statement above, "Let them make their own mess", with no input of articles to show their participation.

MG> you can't blame zone 1 for that. At least there are people
MG> /trying/ to improve things in this zone.
MG> Zone 2 is a victim of it's own disorganization and apathy.

MV> What an utter nonsense. You have obviously no idea what is going on in Zone 2. There is plenty of activity and we are doing fine, thank you.

MG> If you want your zone to have more clout, It is not me, it is the FidoNews editor that wants more zone 2 participation. I am trying to explain why there is so little.

MG> tell it to get it's act together first. You know that saying about people in glass houses?

MV> It is this arrogance that pisses off the Z2 sysops Michael. We do have our act together. Zone 2 is running fine. However, every time a Z2 sysop has the guts to look beyond his own zone and enters a globally distributed area, he gets shouted down by a bunch of Z1 sysops as soon as he opens his mouth. The Z1 sysops /say/ they are interested in the views of others, but they never really listen to what the others have to say... No wonder Z2 sysops shy away from globally distributed areas.

MG> It's this attitude that I always hear from Zone 2 members that it's "all zone 1's fault", I don't know how you got that idea. Sure, some things that have gone wrong /is/ Z1's fault. But not all of it off course.

MG> While seeing few real live proposals to actually improve things in Fidonet.

MV> Then you are not looking in the right places...

WB> The only articles in the last six months are from you outside of the brief commotion Leeman caused when Ward tried to illegaly take him out of the nodelist.

MG> That has led me to think that zone 1 would be better off ust drafting it's own zonal policy, and forgetting about the other zones.

MV> Part of the problem is that from the point of view of the other zones, that is what Z1 has been doing all along....

Think about it.

Cheers, Michiel

WD> You are right in a way, Zone One has always taken the initive if anything got done. You people in Zone Two have a bad attitude toward each other, and some refuse to work with others, on any level.

JMHO too
Ol'wdb